This fits quite well with Psalm 55:9, which states: Lord, confuse the wicked, confound their words, for I see violence and strife in the city., [50] https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/16276/showrashi/true/jewish/Chapter-55.htm. [73] Sanhedrin 69b, https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.69b.11?lang=bi. It was during Davids years as a fugitive from Saul that he met a lovely woman named Abigail. Notice that the sin was in killing Uriah the Hittite and taking his wife! However, Absalom is not named nor is he even hinted at. Credit Line: Bequest of Benjamin Altman, 1913. You are committing a tu quoque fallacy!, an informal fallacy that intends to discredit the opponents argument by asserting the opponents failure to act consistently in accordance with its conclusion(s)., Thus, when Christians say that Muhammads (peace be upon him) marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) was immoral, and if Muslims were to respond by saying well, the Biblical figures married young girls too, so they are also immoral, that would be a tu quoque fallacy. Married the daughter of Eliam (2 Samuel 11:3), who was the son of Ahithophel (2 Samuel 23:34). He didnt go down to his own house. 9 However, Uriah slept at the palace entrance with all his masters servants. 2012-01-09 00:45:39. Brother can you refute this also. The Age Of Rebecca When She Married Isaac - Biblical Perspective, The Shocking Truth About Bathshebas Marriage to David in the Bible. 8 Then David told Uriah, Go down to your house and wash your feet., Uriah left the palace, and a gift from the king was sent after him. As shown, David was declaring that those who had betrayed him and were trying to kill him will not live out half their days. David meets Solomon's mother (Bathsheba) in Jerusalem (2 Samuel 11:1-3). 11-18), God says of the future Israelite kings, he will take.. Could you also so a video refuting Islam Critiqued on the age of Mary. Perhaps there may be a reference in Psalms 41:9; Psalms 55:12-14, to Ahithophel. Not only was this marriage permitted, it resulted in the birth of yet another beloved figure, Solomon. In his commentary, Ibn Kathir stated that the age of marriage coincides with the age of puberty. Hushai the Arkite was the kings confidant. 1 Chronicle 3:5 states that Bathsheba was the daughter of Ammiel, which scholars have explained was simply the reversed form of Eliam. In fact, Ahithophel is mentioned along with Hushai the Arkite in 1 Chronicles 27:33: Ahithophel was the kings counselor. [72] Sometime after, probably 4 years (2 Samuel 15:7) after reconciling with his father David, Absalom began his rebellion. Father of Bathsheba, whose first husband was a Hittite, 1 Samuel 11:3 (= 1 Chronicles 3:5 , where Eliam is called Ammiel ). The reality is that they were the most likely the same person. The Mount of Olives is adjacent to the city of Jerusalem, so David would have had a good view of the city and thus, assuming he wrote the psalm, could have been describing his feelings at the time. [a]ll the expressions used in this verse would probably be applicable to Ahithophel, and to the intimacy between him and David., This was also the conclusion of the classical Jewish sources, such as the Targums and the Talmud, as explained in, But it was thou,. It is not impossible that this Eliam is the same as the preceding., [88] https://www.studylight.org/encyclopedias/mse/e/eliam.html, The same name Eliam also occurs as that of a Gilonite, the son of Ahithophel, and one of Davids thirty warriors (2 Samuel 23:34). King David towers over the Old Testament, and the Son of David towers over the New. Thus, they were following the Jewish customs of the time, which included marriage at around 12 years of age for girls. Heb. The answer comes from Psalm 55:23 (emphasis ours): But you, God, will bring down the wicked into the pit of decay; the bloodthirsty and deceitful will not live out half their days. David asked his servants Thus, when Christians say that Muhammads (peace be upon him) marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) was immoral, and if Muslims were to respond by saying well, the Biblical figures married young girls too, so they are also immoral, that would be a tu quoque fallacy. King David Create. This was also the conclusion of the classical Jewish sources, such as the Targums and the Talmud, as explained in Gills Exposition of the Entire Bible: But it was thou,. Artist: Rembrandt (Rembrandt van Rijn) (Dutch, Leiden 16061669 Amsterdam) Date: 1643. Son of Ahithophrl and father of Bathsheba (https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/e/eliam.html). 23), but of Ahithophels unfaithfulness and the rebellion of Absalom (Chald., the Rabbins, and most interpreters), and indeed not after the outbreak of the rebellion, but shortly before it.. Talmud Niddah 29b; Halacha is clear, ritual bath must be done during the morning hence, there is no connection with Bathsheba who took a bath during the night (2 Samuel 11:2). [61], Thus, it is reasonable to conclude that Ahithophel must have died at a relatively young age. 5 The woman conceived and sent word to David. 52, or the Ziphites, Ps. Psalm 55 is a prayer of David asking God to save him from his enemies. [] This was also based on the Prophets marriage to Aisha. (2Samuel 16:23), So, if Ahithophel was less than 40 years of age at the time of his death (let us conservatively assume he was. It should be noted that the Bible does not state Bathsheba was _ years old. Both of them agreed to help. And do not give the weak-minded your property, which Allah has made a means of sustenance for you, but provide for them with it and clothe them and speak to them words of appropriate kindness. shall not half their days; that is, shall be soon cut off, die in the flower of their age, come to an untimely end [] Absalom and Ahithophel came to tragic and unhappy ends; so did all the primitive persecutors, those cruel crafties.[55], Other commentators also explain the verse this way. And also, I wanna say that I bave wxplained that khayrul makereen does not in no way means best of deceivers and I have explained that Khayrul Makereen means something honorable and something good. Practically, I have helped the authors of DTT website and after I have done that, Im gonna deal with websites like wikiIslam and answering islam. 34,) was one of Davids valiant men, [92] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bul/2-samuel-11.html#3, Eliam. Barnes Notes on the Bible states that: [a]ll the expressions used in this verse would probably be applicable to Ahithophel, and to the intimacy between him and David.[29]. Thus, while marriage at the onset of puberty was not unusual, the Bible indicates that both marriage and sexual intercourse were sometimes permitted at very young ages (though this does not appear to be the norm). Six times in one paragraph (vv. 5. [66] Saul also lived into his seventies. affording him the opportunity to frustrate the counsel of Ahithophel (15:31-37). This is confirmed by most dictionaries, including Smiths Bible Dictionary,[6] the American Tract Society Bible Dictionary,[7] Fausetts Bible Dictionary,[8] the Holman Bible Dictionary,[9] Hastings Bible Dictionary,[10] the Morrish Bible Dictionary,[11] the Peoples Dictionary of the Bible,[12] and the Cyclopedia of Biblical, Theological and Ecclesiastical Literature. He had no pity for Bathshebas grandfather Ahithophel, Davids trusted friend and adviser, [16] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/dcc/2-samuel-15.html#1, Ahithophel (2 Samuel 15:12) was probably Bathshebas grandfather (2 Samuel 11:3; 2 Samuel 23:34)., [17] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bul/2-samuel-11.html#3. 21. The Targum is, but thou Ahithophel; of whom the words are literally to be understood, and so they are in the Talmud (u); and mystically and typically of Judas[30], Other commentaries, such as those of Matthew Poole,[31] John Phillips,[32] C. H. Spurgeon,[33] Chuck Smith,[34] E.W. as Bathsheba was described as having met King David after stepping out of the bath. I am the author, and I have already debunked IC on Rebekah. Webthe Judaism of Moses and David -- Messianic Redemption. Accession Number: 14.40.651. Since this is now firmly established, we may ask what relevance it has in determining Bathshebas age at the time of her marriage to David. WebChapter 1: Women of Faith and Courage Chapter 2: EveFirst Woman in Creation Chapter 3: SarahWife and Mother of Patriarchs Chapter 4: LeahLoved by God Chapter 5: TamarAncestress of the Lord Jesus Christ Chapter 6: Deborah, JaelFearless for God Chapter 7: BathshebaWife and Mother of Kings Chapter 8: Mary of NazarethMother Title: The Toilet of Bathsheba. 2. A minority of scholars questioned the application of the psalm to Ahithophel. Absalom summoned Ahithophel to come to Hebron from his hometown of Giloh (hence, Ahithophel was known as the Gilohite). Information related to the topic how old was bathsheba when she met david. Bathsheba couldnt say no to King David any more than an enslaved Sally Hemmings could say no to Thomas Jefferson. a native of Giloh, was a privy councillor of David, whose wisdom was highly esteemed, though his name had an exactly opposite signification. Even if we grant a new upper limit, 90 years, that does not improve the situation for embarrassed Christian apologists. If you want, I can just make a website refuting your baseless claims. Grants Commentary on the Bible,[23] Alexander McLarens Expositions of Holy Scripture,[24] R.A Torreys Treasury of Scripture Knowledge,[25] The Biblical Illustrator,[26] and The Pulpit Commentary.[27]. Among the Jewish commentaries besides the Talmud and the Targums, Rashi also identified Ahithophel as the subject of the psalm. However, we can still estimate her age using the Biblical chronology. However, this was clearly not the norm (even if true). There is an obvious contradiction. 2 Samuel 11:3 states that Bathsheba was the daughter of Eliam. This is where Psalm 55 comes in. Its date and authorship must be left in the region of mere conjecture. If we add these numbers together, we determine that Solomon was around 911 years old. [13] https://www.studylight.org/encyclopedias/mse/a/ahithophel.html, He probably hoped to wield a greater sway under the vain prince than he had done under David, against whom it is also possible that he entertained a secret malice on account of his granddaughter Bathsheba (2 Samuel 11:3, comp. [2] Of course, in the previous article, I showed evidence from within the Bible. on 2 Samuel 11:3, and 1 Chronicles 3:5) is that the two Eliams are the same person. Using Psalm 55:23, it would mean that Ahithophel could not have gone past the age of 45 years (note again that this is the conservative estimate). Web28 Then King David answered, Call Bathsheba to me. So she came into the king's presence and stood before the king. Furthermore, God approved of David remaining married to Bathsheba, which resulted in the birth of Solomon, whom God loved. This illustrates that Ahithophel was probably a young man (Source: This brings us to the most crucial point of our academic journey of determining Ahithophels age. The reason is given in the genealogical tables, which show that he was the grandfather of Bathsheba, and that his son Eliam was the comrade and friend of Uriah., [27] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tpc/2-samuel-15.html#1, Ahithophel, the grandfather of Bathsheba (2 Samuel 15:12; 2 Samuel:3), [29] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/barnes/psalms/55.htm, [30] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/psalms/55-13.htm, [31] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/poole/psalms/55.htm, that person who was the chief contriver and promoter of this rebellion under Absalom, even to Ahithophel, of whom he spoke [in] Psalm 55:13; and though he doth not excuse the rest, as we have seen, yet he lays the chief blame upon him, and here he adds new aggravations of his treason.. JazahAllahu Khair for your hard word we learn so much from you, Was iyyak. (LogOut/ So 70 - 45 = 25 70 - 50 = 20 Solomon would be 20 to 25 It should also be borne in mind that David was a prophet, as stated in Acts 2:30: But he was a prophet and knew that God had promised him on oath that he would place one of his descendants on his throne.. Both commentaries base their views on the supposition that the psalmist was still in Jerusalem at the time, whereas David found out about the Ahithophels involvement only after he had fled Jerusalem (2 Samuel 15:31). [100] Perhaps most controversial is his refusal to assign a particular age to serve as a cutoff. Note that this is the most. [78] Finally, in Acts 13:22, God is quoted as testifying about David as a man after my own heart. Eliam, in turn, was the son of Ahitophel the Gilonite (2 Samuel 23:34). In what two situations was Bathsheba caught, and how did she respond in each? David was sinful because he had taken another mans wife, not that he had slept with a 7-year old. David also prayed to God to confuse the wicked, [and] confound their words (55:9) and that God would bring down the wicked into the pit of decay (55:23). If this was the normal lifespan at the time, and the bloodthirsty and deceitful will not live out half their days, then we can reasonably estimate Ahithophels age to less than 40 years. To Thomas Jefferson likely the same person his how old was bathsheba when she met david of Giloh ( hence, Ahithophel is mentioned with... If you want, I can just make a website refuting your baseless claims - Biblical Perspective the! Just make a website refuting your baseless claims Rashi also identified Ahithophel as the Gilohite.... Not only was this marriage permitted, it resulted in the Bible a age... As testifying About David as a man after my own heart and stood before king. 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